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  #1  
Old 08-29-2011, 11:19 PM
Arien Malec Arien Malec is offline
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Default Intermittent fasting and weightlifting

Nick Horton (who posts here and hopefully can jump in) wrote the following article:

http://www.theironsamurai.com/2011/0...ke-a-real-man/

I've been combining IF with weightlifting as well. I'd love to hear other folks' experience with this.

Here's mine:

I dropped down 27#, from 207# to 180#, pushed my weight back to 188#, and am dropping down to 182ish again to get more runway to add muscle mass. (I'm one of those guys who finds muscle gain hard and fat gain easy so starting leanish works better for me).

My experiences with low frequency lifting with IF and weight loss were great -- I managed to go down 20# in weight while adding to all my lifts (due to a shoulder problem, I couldn't snatch or jerk but I hit a clean PR having lost 20#).

I then switched to daily lifting with IF. I didn't have the same experience as Nick -- for me, intense lifting always leads to a ravenous appetite which leads to mass gain. Perhaps that's because I've been a fatty in the past, and my body wants to get back there, and Nick was leaner in the past. Dunno.

I tried a weight loss phase with daily lifting which was a disaster because of the same issues: appetite through the roof, natural eating led to weight gain.

On the plus side, when I went from 180# to 188# in 5 weeks, I gained about 4-5# of muscle mass and about 2# fat (yes, it doesn't add up right -- there's rebound weight from glycogen and extra food transit), which is pretty impressive. Part of that was the rebound, but I think the IF approach of massive food intake post workout helped a ton. I guess that it would have been much more effective had I gone more slowly.

So summary for me:

a) IF + weight loss required reduced frequency (this round, I'm doing two big workouts a week and snatching to max one additional day and c&j to max another additional day, which seems to be working).
b) IF + frequent lifting + mass gain was brilliant and would have been better if I could have avoided stuffing my face so much.

Last edited by Arien Malec; 08-30-2011 at 02:50 PM.
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Old 08-30-2011, 12:28 AM
NickHorton NickHorton is offline
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Looks interesting, brother.

I am like you, actually in that when I'm lifting daily I am WAY hungrier. This is why I started adding in a longer fast on Fridays.

I'm currently trying to make it work even better. I'm lifting 5 days a week, M-F, and then fasting on Saturdays for 24 hours (dinner to dinner). I'm still leaning out, actually, but I'm able to hit the gym pretty hard.

On my lifting days, I don't eat till I start lifting at about 1 or 2pm. During the workout I drink a Mocha and gatorade - that breaks my fast. I then will drink some chocolate milk and have some nuts/dried-fruit till I get home from yelling at people (er, coaching) at around 8.

Once I'm home, I'll eat almost constantly till about 10, sometimes later if I feel like it.

So really, I only eat one real meal a day during the week, and then a bunch of calories from a mocha, chocolate milk, gatorade, and nuts. And the fast only lasts about 15 hours. But, that's enough when combined with the one 24-hour fast on the weekend.

I think having at least the one long fast makes the difference. It means that you don't have to be as strict about your calorie count during the more mellow fasts during the week. Those are there just to cut down on the calories that you'd normally add with breakfast and lunch.
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Old 08-30-2011, 11:11 AM
Arien Malec Arien Malec is offline
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That makes a ton of sense. I'll try that when I get back to near daily training and report back results.

The setup you describe for the workout days was exactly how I did it: fasting in the morning, tiny meal on single workout days, small meal after workout #1 on a dual workout day (I did BCAAs prior to WO, then a small carb + protein meal afterwards), then massive eating after the evening.
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Old 08-30-2011, 11:49 AM
Arien Malec Arien Malec is offline
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I'll add that I'm perhaps unique in that I can eat massively enough in 2 hours (6:30 to 8:30) to still gain weight. I have skillz.
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Old 08-30-2011, 12:37 PM
johnnya johnnya is offline
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My 2 cents - I started IF with lifting - regular gym but with an eye to what would help me most when I went back to OL. I train at noon on my lunch hour so digging in right after was not a problem, and getting my session in with just coffee and BCAAs was ok, too.
Initially frustrated that the scale wasn't moving down, but got over that when my pants started fitting better, lifts went up, and people said I looked strong up top. New squat PR without gaining bodyweight I think is a good measure for progress in strength and leanness!
Anyway, then I broke my ankle playing basketball and I'm playing catchup, but same strategy, same general successes.
Nick, that's a good writeup.
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Old 08-30-2011, 10:07 PM
NickHorton NickHorton is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnya View Post
My 2 cents - I started IF with lifting - regular gym but with an eye to what would help me most when I went back to OL. I train at noon on my lunch hour so digging in right after was not a problem, and getting my session in with just coffee and BCAAs was ok, too.
Initially frustrated that the scale wasn't moving down, but got over that when my pants started fitting better, lifts went up, and people said I looked strong up top. New squat PR without gaining bodyweight I think is a good measure for progress in strength and leanness!
Anyway, then I broke my ankle playing basketball and I'm playing catchup, but same strategy, same general successes.
Nick, that's a good writeup.
Thanks Johnnya,

Your gaining strength without gaining weight, and still leaning out is exactly my next goal. I'll let you know how it goes.
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Old 08-31-2011, 09:43 AM
johnnya johnnya is offline
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Nick, it was a slow change, and the leaning/recomp is my interpretation. Didn't do any serious BF% testing before hand, but I think the front and back squat prs, static scale weight, and subjective opinions (mine and others) support the idea I was doing a leaning/recomp.
I am trying to play with some longer fasting now, as I am backing off the lifting a little this month, trying to get lots of outside time on my bike, etc while it's still nice and light after work hours.
Have you tried the pulse fast or feast at all? It's a T-Nation thing, but I think I saw Dan John say he threw in one pulse fast a week and people noticed. Though it might just be the addition of any fast that helps.
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Old 09-04-2011, 04:20 PM
NickHorton NickHorton is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnya View Post
Have you tried the pulse fast or feast at all? It's a T-Nation thing, but I think I saw Dan John say he threw in one pulse fast a week and people noticed. Though it might just be the addition of any fast that helps.
I think just fasting is the key. If you lower your calories, you lower you calories. There is more going on during a longer fast (post 18 hours), but in the end, you can't lose fat unless you're in some kind of deficit in the fast majority of cases. At least for some of us, fasting is a very easy way to do this.
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  #9  
Old 09-06-2011, 08:00 AM
johnnya johnnya is offline
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The throwing in BCAAs throughout the "fast" just looked to me like it might be a way to reduce muscle loss while reaching deeper calorie deficits, but it might be too much tinkering.
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  #10  
Old 09-06-2011, 02:03 PM
richg1984 richg1984 is offline
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Default IF Questions

Hey Nick,

I really enjoyed your piece on IF. I, myself, stumbled upon leangains after a post on the Crossfit Football website.

Moving forward, I would like to apply the IF approach to my own training. At the present time, I train from 630-830 in the morning M-W-F. As a result of a broken thumb, these workouts are squat dominant. I am accustomed to eating immediately after training in the morning so I am a little hesistant about Martin's AM protocol which is heavily dependent on BCAA's.

I usually do not eat post-workout so there is not much of a change there.

I would welcome any of your ideas and reflections. Honestly, I do not need to lose a huge amount of weight b/c I'm approx 10-11% BF (6'3" roughly 210#). A cut of 10-12# would be great and might help my running/jumping/basic lifestyle.

Thanks for any ideas.
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